Innovating through Adversity: Charlie's Sustainable Retail Evolution

Join me on an inspiring journey with the inspiring  Charlie, founder of Zero store. Sparked by a casual conversation that fuelled her eco-conscious path, Charlie is proof that a bright idea, resilience, and a bit of elbow grease are some of the skills it takes to build a successful sustainable retail venture. With a background as fascinating as hers, ranging from performing arts to teaching in a men's prison, we delve deep into how these experiences forged her into the problem-solving entrepreneur she is today.

Take a peek into Charlie's world as we traverse her journey from setting up a humble market stall to overseeing two thriving shop fronts. Listen to her touching account of how she weathered the storm of the pandemic, innovatively pivoting her business model to a click and collect service. Despite the pandemic's isolating nature, Charlie found creative ways to foster a sense of community and connect more closely with her customers, proving that adversity often brings out our best qualities.

Ending on a note of empowerment and inspiration, Charlie generously shares her perspectives on using business as a force for good, supporting local communities, and charities. She believes in offering an experience that goes well beyond a mere transaction, one that nurtures a sense of care and belonging. So, tune in for an episode brimming with wisdom, inspiration, and Charlie's unwavering enthusiasm for sustainable retail. It's time to get recharged, refuelled, and ready to make a difference...

Connect with Charlie on Instagram and shop online here https://zerostore.co.uk/

Transcript

Charlie: 0:00

just always enjoying it, I think, is the main thing. Like every time I spend some time in the shop interacting with customers and with the rest of the team, I'm always reminded by how much I really enjoy what I do, and I always tell customers that I'll say oh, you know, I get up every day and I still really, really enjoy it and really get a real buzz out of it.

Zoe: 0:23

Hello, it's Zoe and welcome, or welcome back to the Mischief Movement podcast, your weekly inspo for people looking for more hell yeah in their life. Consider this your one way to get out of midlife mediocrity towards fun and positive impact via playful disruption. Wouldn't you love to wake up and feel like a total badass? How about breaking some rules, throwing two fingers up to society and doing more of the things you love? I'm talking full on freedom, adventure and those meaningful connections I know you've been craving. Stop waiting for your amazing life to happen and go get it. I'll be picking the brains of some true game changes and mischief makers so I can share what I find and hopefully inspire you to shake things up. Do more of what makes you feel alive and boldly rebel against the ordinary. I've no idea what I'm doing, to be honest, but I've got a mission and I'm here to start a movement. This could be quite the adventure. Care to join me? Okay, here goes. Have you ever considered opening your own shop, and when did we're to begin? Or have you gone through life collecting skills and experiences, yet not been sure where they were leading or how to consolidate them?

Zoe: 1:39

Allow me to introduce you to Charlie, who set off on her own sustainable retail journey back in 2018, navigating young children, a pandemic and, as in her own words, no real idea about running a business. But, as usual on this podcast, we uncovered so much more than just shop talk. Charlie has been known to rebuild classic cars using just Haynes manuals and YouTube videos, has led writing and creative workshops in a men's prison and has a background in performing arts. Unsurprisingly, the common threads that run through all she does are problem solving and connecting people with a healthy dose of fun thrown in. Retail needn't ever be boring and careers can always pivot and change, as Charlie testifies here. Okay then, well, this week I am joined by the lovely Charlie, founder of Zero Store in my home area of work. Not just one Zero Store, but actually two. So, without me giving everything away, charlie, do you want to introduce yourself and tell everybody what your, what your main mischief is?

Charlie: 2:52

So I'm the founder of Zero, which was created in 2018. And we are a I can actually say this. We're a multi award winning retailer now and we sell locally sourced products which are free of signal use plastic, and our whole ethos is to try and help people have a much lower impact on the planet and be kinder to the planet and not have plastic and not have an environmentally friendly products in their lives as much.

Zoe: 3:22

Amazing and congratulations multi award winning. That's no small feat.

Charlie: 3:29

Yeah, we've won the best sustainable lifestyle business for Warranty and West Midlands as part of the Muddy Stilettos award for the last two years in a row. So we just had the award ceremony for the 2023 one last week, which I took my very loyal dad to with me, because I'm surrounded by a really great support network and it's really important to recognize those people as well. It's not all just me. I'm the founder, but I've got an amazing team around me as well.

Zoe: 3:57

That's so lovely, and I guess your team really came, came through for you when the pandemic hit, because I imagine it was quite difficult for you, wasn't it?

Charlie: 4:10

So the pandemic came, came along when we had opened the Lamington Spa shop only four months previously, and so we we only really we didn't really have a single month of kind of normal trade really, because we were very much still finding our feet and I'd recently employed a full time member of staff and another part time member of staff just before it all happened, which was a good thing really, because there's no way that I could have got through the pandemic pandemic on my own. So we had to be really flexible, we had to be very nimble. I'd never built a website before, apart from a very basic kind of landing page affair, and overnight I had to build a click and collect offering myself and Cooley, who was the wonderful lady that was working with me back then. We got our heads together. It was like a sunny, sunny Sunday evening and I remember we met at the shop and got our heads together and made a plan and decided that we were going to change our opening hours and we were only going to have like one person come into the doorway to get what they needed, and then the afternoons were going to be wholly for click and collect, so that we could keep all of those operations separate and it worked.

Charlie: 5:22

Yeah, it worked really well. We were very much kind of just reacting as we went along and doing what we felt was right for our customers and right for the team, and so we did continue to grow throughout the pandemic and a lot of the customers that we have now people who've shopped with us since way back when we were a market stall in 2018, all they found us during the pandemic and they've remained loyal to us, so it's lovely. Good thing about click and collect is you then get to know all of your customers' names as well, at a time when you would have thought people were being brought further apart. Like we actually found small ways to safely kind of have more of a connection with our customers, which was really really nice.

Zoe: 6:06

Yeah, that's kind of surprising, but it's so nice to hear something positive coming out of the pandemic. Take me back then. Take us back to when you were a market stall, or before then even. How did the whole concept of zero come about?

Charlie: 6:26

So it all began when my youngest son was about eight weeks old and I had a friend who we met working together as primary school teachers and had lots in common. And we'd met and met up in the park on this day and I had this tiny baby in a carrier and I think my other son, who was younger than two at that time, was at nursery that day and we were talking about how we've been trying to make changes in our everyday lives to be more eco-friendly. So over the previous few months we've been doing things like trying to buy fruit and vegetables without plastic packaging, we've been trying shampoo bars, we've been making our own snacks at home for our children and ourselves instead of buying them in plastic packaging. And we were just saying to each other would it be great if there was somewhere locally where you could take your own containers and refill them and buy the amounts you wanted and not have the packaging? And this place would have loads of things that were locally sourced as well, so that you could be connected with those businesses via the shop. And we were saying, why doesn't this exist? We really want it to exist for ourselves. So we kind of decided on that day that we were going to make it happen for ourselves. We were going to start it up and that's exactly what we did.

Charlie: 7:49

So over the next 10 months we operated via kind of pop-up events and markets from the boot of our cars. So we had a lot of kiln and jars full of produce. We had a couple of sets of scales, a couple of basic card readers and no real idea about running a business, to be honest. But we did that for 10 months and we were really really overwhelmed by the amount of support that we had and how many other people really shared this vision. And I started to sort of teach myself how to use social media and used that to kind of publicise what we were doing. And it worked well. So it was a great way to start out and it was so much fun. And then at the end of that period, my friend and co-founder announced that her husband had got a job in Sweden, so she was going to be moving to Sweden permanently. And that was the point where I had to think okay, I can't continue this as a market stall on my own. It's way too much physical.

Zoe: 8:50

It's a lot of work, isn't it?

Charlie: 8:52

Oh, yeah, it really is. I mean, you have the time where you're actually doing your stall, but then you've easily got like two or even three hours either side with all the travelling and loading and unloading and restocking and everything. And so around the same time, just completely by fortune, the landlady of my Leamington shop, who we'd got to know through doing public puts, sort of approached me and said oh, I'm moving to a bigger shop, I'm expanding. I think that this shop would be really good for you. I think it would work really well in terms of location and size and everything. So we went to look at it and it really didn't need a ton of work either. It was in pretty good shape, and still is, because she looked after it really well over the 10 years she'd been there herself.

Charlie: 9:41

And then, yeah, then there was the job of kind of convincing my husband that this was going to be a viable thing to do. So we sat down and did a lot of planning and really factored in you know how we could make this work around family life as well. And then, yeah, we got the keys in September and then we opened in November and that's how the first chapter all kind of panned out and yeah, I really think back on those times. There was a lot of fondness because it was so much fun and it's been a huge learning curve. It was then and still is, but yeah, it really was so much fun.

Zoe: 10:19

It sounds like the shop was really so really serendipitous in that moment that you had to make that decision. Yeah definitely.

Charlie: 10:27

Yeah, the timing a bit was just perfect and my employer at the school that I was working at were also really supportive and they let me kind of. I mean it was quite tricky. I went back from maternity leave and basically on the first day back from maternity leave had to say I'm opening a shop and I'm probably going to be leaving that requires a lot of courage.

Charlie: 10:54

I think you're a very courageous woman it was, yeah, and you know, I think, in general, like especially for women, actually, you know, we are a smaller proportion of entrepreneurs and business owners. And so, yeah, at that point, when it was like I've got a baby and a toddler and I started this thing and I'm going to be leaving what is a very stable and enjoyable career slash vocation, because teaching is so much more than a career, isn't it? You live in really there, you really do, and, yeah, I do remember being really nervous that day, but they were brilliant and they sort of made it work and I had like a phased kind of leaving period where, for the part where the shop had opened but I was still working at school, I was able to go down to one day a week, which was, you know, very, very kind and supportive of them, and I'm really really grateful for that.

Zoe: 11:56

That's fantastic. Had you always thought about running your own business or becoming an entrepreneur, or was it something that just kind of snuck up on you in that conversation with your friend?

Charlie: 12:08

It definitely did sneak up on me. I think it was more about how passionate I was about the things that we do and the things that we offer, and that's what pulled me through. I've always been interested, maybe without even realizing it, in being more sustainable. So, you know, me and my sister were brought up with second hand clothes, second hand toys. I spent a lot of time with one set of my grandparents as a child who were, you know, world War II rationing era make, doing, mend, make things from scratch, don't waste anything. And without even realizing that really did kind of rub off on me, even to the point with my grandfather who was always tinkering. He was a massive tinkerer with like lawnmowers, cars, motorbikes, wireless radios all those kinds.

Charlie: 13:07

Yeah, and I never realized it.

Charlie: 13:09

But sort of from the age of around kind of 20, up until when I did my teacher training, when I was about 28, 29, I was really, really interested in classic cars and spent years with my friends just doing exactly what my granddad used to do, just tinkering with cars.

Charlie: 13:33

So I mean much to my parents' dismay, because I was constantly coming home with these really old bangers and then fixing them up using my Haynes manual with the help of friends and stuff and, yeah, just teaching myself. And I mean there was one summer where I had a Mark Ion Golf convertible at the time and the engine on it I think it had done about 180,000 miles, it had been, it had loads of owners, it had been all over the place, it had been all over Europe, it had had loads of stories from the previous owner about how much fun it had been. And I managed to rebuild the engine over the course of the summer like when I was on holidays from my other job at the time, which was also term time only using just a Haynes manual and YouTube.

Zoe: 14:22

Charlie, what kind of superwoman are you?

Charlie: 14:28

I mean, youtube is fantastic, like you know, the Haynes manual is good. But then it will say refitting is the reverse of removal and you're like this is a 20 step process, I can't do this. But I found this scous guy on YouTube who was rebuilding the exact same engine in his little brick courtyard of his terraced house, step by step, and so, yeah, I just followed that and just persevered and yeah, so we had a lot more fun in that car. After that I did a couple of road trips with friends in it and yeah. So I think I've naturally always been interested in being more sustainable and kind of saving things from waste. But then I've also somehow had this ability in me to kind of teach myself new skills and, you know, be really interested in learning how things work, and I'm very much kind of jack of all trades, master of none. But I think if you do put your mind to it, then there's a lot of things where pure determination and enthusiasm can pull you through.

Zoe: 15:34

Yeah, I mean, I had a conversation about being a jack of all trade with Max McMurdo on a previous episode and in actual fact, it's such a blessing because he brings so many skills to the table in whatever you do. So you know this whole thing about not having a particular specialism or feeling like you know, perhaps you're not as good in one thing as another like it's amazing. It's a skill in itself to have all of these interests and all of this experience.

Zoe: 16:01

So okay, when you were running your market stall, you made it sound like it was a really easy process. You had this conversation with your friend. You decided you were going to do this thing. The next thing you're up and running with this, with a market stall and pop ups. But like, what did you even do to get from that conversation to being able to have a market stall? Because where did you even source all of your stock? Quite a journey.

Charlie: 16:33

Yeah, so we I remember we made a very basic kind of Google form survey which we put out via like lots of local Facebook groups and that gave us an idea of what things people wanted. I mean, at the time there weren't really hardly any shops like ours around, even nationally or internationally. So we had to think about you know what were the essentials that would be a priority for us. And then I started to research kind of local suppliers and I always tell people this story. I found Monsoon Estates Coffee who were based just outside of Stratford. It's a family owned coffee roastery. They've been roasting coffee for years. They started roasting coffee in their own kitchen at home because they wanted nice coffee for themselves.

Charlie: 17:21

It's a really lovely story. There's such nice people and I remember I had a chat with them via email and then I think I bumped into them at the Fargo Village Coffee Festival in Coventry as well, like a few weeks later, and has another chat to Chris there who is like one of the co founders, and they invited me to go to the roastery. So I went over to the roastery on this really kind of blustery, rainy evening like it must have been sort of yeah, it must have been like September time I think, and so like, sorted out kids baby, put them to bed, so and so forth went over there and they just greeted me with so much warmth and I told them about what we wanted to do and how we wanted to do it, and they were just so enthusiastic. They were like this is a great idea. You'll be the first person to ever stock our coffee without packaging. We've never done this before, but we love it. We think it's brilliant.

Charlie: 18:20

And I came away from from that meeting thinking to myself like I feel like I've got to do it now. I felt this really could happen now. It kind of gave me that little boost of you know, you really can do this. And then found lots of other local suppliers, including our cleaning products company, who are actually only based in Northamptonshire, so not a million miles away, and I've been to the factory there on a number of occasions. But yeah, I remember the first time that I went there I was actually so nervous because I was like, oh, you know, it feels like these are all kind of it's a proper business and they're proper business people. And here's me. And yeah, again, they were just so, yeah, so keen and really happy to see somebody else like buying into what they wanted to do.

Zoe: 19:08

There's a lot to be said also for for having the passion and the enthusiasm, I think, when you meet these people, because if they can see that passion shining out of your face, they start to believe in the mission as well.

Charlie: 19:20

Yeah, definitely. And then I, through kind of internet research and a couple of Facebook groups, I found some Whole Foods cooperatives. So for like anything that we can't get locally, we try wherever possible to use either a family owned business or Whole Foods cooperative. There's none of this kind of like Costco or you know. We don't use kind of. You know we don't go and fill up a trolley in Tesco with things in packets and then empty them into dispensers with it was. It was kind of more so than I realized straight away. It was really important to think about the supply chain and certainly, as the years have gone on, I've become more and more interested in kind of the story of things where things come from what things are made of.

Charlie: 20:06

And yeah, certainly, when we're adding new products, which we've done kind of gradually, we've never, you know, we've never gone all out and just got things in. For the sake of it, we've done it very, in a very considered way. And yeah, I always want to know about the people behind it and you know what is it made of and obviously want to avoid things like unsustainable palm oil or any kind of human or random exploitation that might be part of that product. And I think, as time has gone on, that's, you know, that's something that our customers have. Really it's become kind of like a real force within the business I was going to ask you whether that was something that mattered a lot to your customers.

Charlie: 20:47

Yeah. So I think to begin with it was kind of like, oh right, we want to be plastic free, but then, as time gone on, as time has gone on, not only having really lovely, friendly personal service which I'm sure something we'll probably get on to later in our chat but yeah, that real knowledge and provenance of everything that we do, and it about kind of you know about it being us that do that research so that our customers don't have to, our customers can then really rest easy and relax and you know, in the knowledge that we're doing the very best that we can with where we get everything from.

Zoe: 21:21

Yeah, and I think I mean that's key, isn't it, to running a successful business? It's one of the factors, you know, are you saving people time? Are you saving them money? You're doing both of those things and you're saving them the trouble of having to go and source these products and these suppliers themselves.

Charlie: 21:40

You're bringing it all to them, to their doorstep, practically especially if you've got the online ordering as well, yeah exactly, yeah, which was something that we only started to do just over a year ago. We'd always done click and collect since the pandemic, but with the kind of there being a real wave, unfortunately, of a lot of zero way shops nationally closing down and it meant that there was, all of a sudden, a lot of people that didn't have that option locally anymore. So it felt like a natural progression for us to try and kind of fill that gap rather than, you know, ending up using something like Amazon instead.

Zoe: 22:24

This episode is kindly sponsored by Plyte Club, a brand whose mission is to change the attitude towards vulnerability by encouraging more conversation around it in order to increase real human connection. When you can express your feelings constructively, you can work through your fears, open your heart and find your place in the world. The vehicle for these conversations is clothing, or connection clothing as it's become known. Connection is one of my core values, so I'm thrilled to be able to partner with Plyte Club so we can join in our collective goal of bringing people together and helping you rebel against staying the same Sustainable, organic and rebellious. Of course, plyte Club also uses 50% of their profits to fund proactive suicide prevention in the form of coaching, support and awareness raising, which enables people to understand their emotions and express how they feel constructively. Become a vulnerable with us. For more info on the brand or to buy online, go to Plyte Club dot co dot uk or follow an Instagram at Plyte Club HQ. Now back to the show. Can your brand have a real sort of community vibe to it?

Charlie: 23:38

So I am very interested and supportive of the small business community in both Lemmington and Stratford. In Stratford I'm actually part of a committee which is a local business action group as well. When it comes to social media, I'm not very good at giving it the hard sell. Me personally, when I'm engaging with social media from other companies, I don't want to see like, oh, buy this, buy that, buy this partially because that's not what our shop is all about, but also because I feel like if you've got a following and we have got quite a large social media following now then it's almost kind of part of your responsibility to use that for good as well. So I'll often post about other businesses on our social media.

Charlie: 24:31

We also work with the local food banks in Coventry, warwick, stratford, and there's an independent organisation called the Hope Community Project that we work with in Coventry as well. So they aren't linked to the food banks. Therefore they don't get any of the same support. So we try to support them wherever we can. And then over the last few years we've donated to various charities. We've done like fundraisers for charities. We've sold certain products in the aid of a charity, with all the proceeds going to that, and I think it's just another way to be kind of more than a shop, if that makes sense. It's another way to kind of really, you know, have that caring ethos at the heart of what you do and try and use your platform for good as well.

Zoe: 25:15

Absolutely, and I think you know this idea of using social media to sell products. I think if you've got the client base, you don't need a hard sell, because people are buying into what you stand for. They're buying into the ethos of the brand, the good that you're putting out into the world, and you know it's not so much about the selling then, it's about serving them. So I know that you've got some very low customers.

Charlie: 25:46

Yeah, we have. They are amazing. Yeah, they're really lovely and I mean, for example, on Sunday I was in the Lamington shop and because Stratford has still relatively new, I do spend kind of more of my time focused there overall. But yeah, I just had the nicest day like all the kind of like old school regulars coming in filling up and, you know, putting the world to rights and chatting and exchanging stories and recipes and tips and all those things. And I mean, when I say like the phrase more than a shop, it takes me back to when we first opened in Lamington and this elderly lady came in and had a little look around and asked how it worked and whatnot, and then, with this complete serious tone, she just went this isn't a shop and I was like, oh my gosh. And she was like this is the future and I was like I just love that.

Charlie: 26:45

So we've really adopted that. As you know, this isn't a shop, this is the future and it should be much more than just transactional. You know where people come. You know they have a list that they need. They've come get it. If they want it to be purely transactional, that is absolutely fine, you know. But then we really try to offer a bit more than that. We try to offer like a whole experience and to really show people that we're really interested in them. We're interested in them and we're interested in what they're doing and what they need and, you know, making sure that they're okay. I think that's so valuable.

Zoe: 27:16

I love the word experience. It's so valuable when you find places like that and people like you, because, as you say, you don't often just want a transaction. Everybody needs a little bit more care and attention, but we rarely get it, do we?

Charlie: 27:32

And it's something which the supermarkets are removing. You know, checkouts being replaced by self-checkouts, for example. They're going the other way. I mean, the refill trials at the supermarkets have done have never been a success, because this way of shopping it needs people to look after it, it needs people to make sure that spills get cleaned up or there's no cross-contamination, or that people understand the process and are confident in doing all of the weighing and everything. And you know the whole kind of what makes supermarkets so successful is they're huge but they've got the minimum amount of people possible in them. So I don't think that, like what we do, could ever really scale to be successful in a supermarket and in a lot of ways that gives us a real edge it really does yeah yeah absolutely.

Zoe: 28:23

and what do you do when you know things get difficult because it does sound like such an idyllic job to have? You've created this fantastic business. You've got an amazing community behind you and a team to support you. You're doing what you love, but there must be hard days. What do you do when you get those kind of hard days to kind of lift yourself up again?

Charlie: 28:49

I briefly mentioned about the fact that so many shops like ours had closed down and I really think this is important to mention. So, from 2019 to 2020, there was an explosion in how many zero-way shops there were in the UK and I guess, to some extent, in other countries as well, and it almost got to the point where you could find one like in nearly every town. A lot of people started to do like mobile refills as well, so doorstep refills or pop-ups like we used to do, or even like a little mini zero-way shop within a van, which is a really lovely idea. And, yeah, it completely exposed the point where there were hundreds and hundreds of them, but unfortunately, due to a combination of factors so I guess we could consider Brexit being the one of them and the impact that has had on cost prices Obviously, the cost of living crisis.

Charlie: 29:53

I know that the pandemic had a big impact on some more than others and personally we were okay, but there were other shops which it was very detrimental to them, and so I would say, probably since January 2021, they've been closing down at a rate of around two or three a week, I would estimate. So, yeah, it's been quite tough. It's obviously been really tough for those people who undoubtedly put their heart and soul into it. But, yeah, I felt that, like on Instagram, every week, I would see oh sorry, unfortunately we'll be closing or we can't carry on anymore, because for a lot of reasons, I think, probably burnout being one of them, if you never get to the point of actually having a team around you and you're doing all on your own, no one can sustain that for years on end. But then also things like lack of custom and cash flow and so on as well, and we haven't been exempt from having a bit more trouble.

Charlie: 30:56

Certainly, the cost of living crisis we found had an impact like December last year. 2022 was hugely, hugely down on the December before and we do have some really difficult days. I mean what I do. I mean it's important not to have toxic positivity, I think, because you know you sometimes have to face facts and go. Okay, you know this has been a rubbish day.

Charlie: 31:24

This has been a rubbish week, this has been a rubbish month, and so on, but we've really tried to innovate, so we've looked at other ways we can work with other businesses, so not only supplying businesses with our cleaning refills in a zero waste way, which has given us like a bit of extra custom, but also like collaborating with other businesses, the most notable one being that we offered well, we do it every year Mother's Day flowers with a local florist called Lois Golding, aka Little Garden Flowers. So, rather than her having to do like 66 different delivery runs, we allowed people to order Mother's Day British grown plastic free bouquets via our website, or they could reserve them in store and then they collected from. You know, they were our customs anyway, generally and then they collected from us, and that was a you know, it's just another way to give us a little boost, and I mean my husband is, I would call, never endingly supportive, but also with a dose of realism, and I mean fortunately for me. He has always believed in what I've done, even though he's by no means a sustainability expert, but he's also always really valued my own personal well being.

Charlie: 32:44

So in October of 2020, I was actually completely like unutterably burned out and probably realized that I needed to take a break and slow down a bit, when it was already kind of two or three months after I should have done so. I was a little bit poorly then and, yeah, the team at zero and my husband were both really, really supportive in making sure that I slowed down, started to get more rest and asked for help for things when I needed it and, yeah, that meant that now I'm like I've been in a much better place and I can almost see the signs of when I'm doing too much coming in now rather than. What does that look like? So being really tired but like not really feeling like I've slept very well, working constantly like morning till night, which, when it's your own business, is so easy to do.

Charlie: 33:39

Yeah, because the to do list will never get to the end of that lesson. And actually it was my husband that said this to me. He was like you do realize that, like you're never going to get to the end of the to do listing, that's it all done? There will always be new things popping up and it's up to you to just kind of work out what is urgent, what is important and what's the crossover between them. And that's where you try and exist, isn't it? And so that's definitely one.

Charlie: 34:06

And then, yeah, not taking time to do the things that I enjoy. So, you know, not seeing enough of my friends not getting out in fresh air and doing physical exercise, and yeah, so I'm really good now at going. Actually, if I maybe do no work this day, this morning, but then decide to sit down at the laptop for an hour or two in the evening, it's not the end of the world, because it means that I can, you know, make the most of some beautiful weather or go and meet a friend for coffee or something like that. And so, yeah, really kind of trying to prioritize that balance.

Zoe: 34:41

I love that because it kind of takes us back to this whole essence of putting the fun higher up the list, which is what this you know what the podcast is all about. Let's kind of take the seriousness down a notch and put fun back up a little higher.

Charlie: 34:59

So yeah, what's that joke saying? That always makes me laugh. It's oh, I love, I love having my own business. It means I get to choose which 16 of the 24 hours a day I work, you know. So it is like you. You're right, you really have to put a limit on it. And I know that this summer we're going to have a probably the best balance that we've had yet, because we're actually going away for two holidays in August, once to call and roll and once to Norfolk. I've got two separate, like six, five, six, eight holidays planned with the kids and yeah, that's something that I never would really would have dreamed of like a few years ago. Even having a weekend off or a few days in a row off, then would have felt like a big thing.

Zoe: 35:47

It sounds like it's something that you just kind of have to learn about yourself as you go. Really, I doubt there are many people who start off on this entrepreneurial journey knowing completely how to how to set those boundaries and stick to them.

Charlie: 36:03

I think probably it's one of those things that you just have to work your way through, particularly when the first few years of having your own business is probably going to be where you have to put the most graft in as well. You know, that's the point where you almost do need to give it your all in a little bit more to establish it. And so, yeah, you know, okay, we had the pandemic and a whole host of other things thrown into the mix, but I do kind of feel, yeah, sometimes it's hard to feel proud of yourself as well. I think sometimes it's like you have this blurred line between between, like, well, am I proud or am I actually being a bit full of myself? And I think that, certainly for me, I don't like that kind of oh, I hope I didn't come across as arrogant because we won an award or you know, like we had an amazingly busy weekend this weekend, but I don't want to bloat about it or anything like that. But you know it's a success that's earned, isn't it so?

Zoe: 37:03

it's a success that's earned and, I think, deservingly celebrated. You know, I think we don't do enough of that Celebrating our wins, because we do worry too much about how that comes across. But you know, if nobody celebrates their wins, then nobody else feels like they can either.

Charlie: 37:20

So and that's why I try and keep a big dose of fun in our social media as well, like I really want to. You know I don't want to be like the Alan sugar of zero waste or whatever. I really want to like put that across that we are real people, and I mean anyone who's watched like our Instagram reels, for example, you'll see that like we do like to have a bit of a chuckle at our own expense every now and then, so Certainly always yeah, always bring the fun, especially if it's a serious issue or a serious environment.

Zoe: 37:53

Yeah, what else do you do to have fun? Because I've already learned on this podcast that used to tinker with old cars which I had no idea about, which is highly exciting. And what else do you like to get into?

Charlie: 38:07

So I'm really interested although I don't do it hugely often really interested in crafting and sewing, and so I taught myself how to do patchwork when I was doing my teacher training because I was living in London at the time and, yeah, I didn't have like a enough time for much of a social life. So when I sat at home and sorted out all my planning and done my marketing and whatnot, I taught myself how to do like peace to patchwork and also cross stitch as well, which is like a relic of my childhood. I really enjoyed that as a kid so I picked that. I picked that up every now and then Going out, kind of exploring. So if we ever go away somewhere or even just from home, we like to have days out at various national trust properties. We've gotten national trust membership as a family and we all really really enjoy that, especially the kids there. Yeah, my children have got boundless energy.

Charlie: 39:03

And then at the moment I am going through the couch to five K program again so I really wanted to get back into running and I hadn't.

Charlie: 39:12

I mean, I kind of built myself up to do in a few 10 K's and so on, like probably November 21 around the time when we got the keys to the strafford shop.

Charlie: 39:22

So correlation of that then tailing off, make sense and because I've been so busy, but yeah, so I'm just over halfway through the program now doing that again.

Charlie: 39:30

And then, yeah, I really love to do a lot of home baking as well and so I met all with kind of sourdough bread, yeast of breads. I mean, like I said about my granddad kind of inadvertently influencing me with the tinker inside of things like his wife, my grandma on that side was very much like a big home cook, so I think that her the kind of the food side of thing kind of made its way there and I've still got quite a few of her old kitchen bits and bulbs as well, like some of her pyrex and a really cool glass jelly mold and stuff. So, yeah, those things live on. Yeah, and yeah, it's, I really enjoy using them and just kind of exploring different recipes, whether I find them on the internet or I love actually love a cookbook as well, because it's something so Tactile about having the photos and kind of flicking through and yeah, it's a certain satisfaction of that compared to just, you know, googling something and following a web page on your phone.

Zoe: 40:37

Yeah, absolutely and I think it's that, that nostalgia also that it brings in with it as well as no.

Charlie: 40:44

Making things from scratch is just another way to be low waste as well, because you don't. You know, you don't have to have all the packaging that comes with and we always hire. There's a bit of a party kit hire, like where you can hire. I mean I don't think they have it near you, but there's a few different places and works that do it.

Zoe: 41:04

You can hire all of the balls and plates and cups and things instead of yeah, yeah, just all that waste of the plastic plates and forks and stuff. I mean, the thing I love about what you do is that you saw a problem and you and your friend were like let's solve it. Essentially, you were sort of thinking out the box and thinking about it differently and Then using using that to make a positive impact in your community, which you know, for me, is the ultimate in in mischief making. It's that sort of like no, I'm not going to do it this way, I'm going to find a new way. That's probably a better way. Have you always been a bit of a rebel, or is that? You know, something that's come about more recently?

Charlie: 41:50

I was model student at school actually, but when I left school, rather than like going to the sixth form at my school, I went to a college that was in another town, so like 20 minute bus drive away. I did become a bit more of a kind of a punk rocker like maybe it's hard to imagine it now, but this is kind of like A mixture of the pop punk era, but then also I was really a fan of bands like the clash and the dead Kennedys as well. So, yeah, I had like a few years of going into loads of gigs and I suppose I've never really followed like the trajectory of of most people who go through education like I Left senior school with good grades, then decided that I was going to do performing arts at college and so I wasn't like your standard, kind of like maths, english Kind of girl, and so I went to a BTEC and performing arts there, which I really, really enjoyed and and that was, yeah, well and truly my kind of like punk phase.

Charlie: 43:00

And then went to university in whole of all places, and I took a year out in between where I managed to save up lots of money for uni because at the time my dad he'd worked in the textiles industry British textiles industry for like decades and that was going for a very, very difficult time and as unfortunately continue to decline since then. You know the cost of fast fashion, isn't it? So, yeah, I saved it. So many went after uni and hull and studied drama for three years and what I was most interested in kind of towards the end of my degree was actually the designing and making side of things, so focused more on sonography and, yeah, and set design and wrote my dissertation on set design.

Charlie: 43:48

But I came out of that whole process like not really knowing what I wanted to do, like I knew I enjoyed the theatre and I knew I enjoyed all the different aspects of drama that I'd done when I was at uni. But I, yeah, I didn't have like a real direction in life. So I kind of floated around doing some admin jobs for a while and then started working for a children's drama academy, so like an after school club. So that was where my first interest in being an educator came about, and at the same time I also got a job teaching in a local men's prison as well. So I would do like the evening classes in things like creative writing and handwriting, drama, all sorts English as a foreign language. What was that like as an experience?

Zoe: 44:38

I do know.

Charlie: 44:38

I think people expect it to be like one of the programs that you see on TV but feature prisons, and it's really not and like so many of the people that you will encounter there and you know they've got, they've got really positive attributes to them. You know there's some people that are just a bit lost in the world. There's some people that you know they've just had a really unfortunate series of events in their life, and addiction is a big part of this as well. But yeah, I really enjoyed it and I can. I can tell you I never felt unsafe there. I didn't feel unsafe and there were a couple of like slightly odd characters, but I got to do some really lovely projects with them. Like we did a creative writing project where the prisoners who had children at home Were able to write a story and then record a story and then I helped them write and illustrate the books to go with. So it was like they would send the book with their illustrations and an audio recording of them reading story with lots of like sound effects, music and things back home so that they could kind of be present and part of their bedtime bedtime for those children, some of which were just like you know, babies and toddlers From there.

Charlie: 45:55

I ended up doing that and I was also working at a preschool and I was working as a waitress and I got to this point where I was like I am doing like four different things and maybe I need to find a way to consolidate all these skills.

Charlie: 46:10

And then that was where I kind of fell into doing my teacher training working in primary schools and and did that for another nine years and it was a good consolidation of everything that I previously learned as well. I went through all my teacher training files the other day actually and, yeah, I really look back on them with funness. It was. I mean, anyone who's a teacher will tell you that you do it for the kids. You know the kids of when. If you leave teaching is the kids that you really miss. Had some very fun times with colleagues Really so many wonderful children that I've worked with over the years who can often teach us the meal, the real meaning of things like resilience, you know like, yeah, children are incredible and it was just a joy to watch them grow and develop really in that previous job.

Zoe: 46:57

Yeah, do you know what sort of springs to mind that when I when I hear you talking about Consolidating your skills and your experiences, this idea of bringing people together, especially when you talk about being in the prison and sort of connecting people and in a way, it feels like you're still doing that within your shop because, as you so rightly said, it's more than a shop. You're bringing people together and you're creating that kind of community around you. Where do you think you're going to take it next?

Charlie: 47:29

That's a really good question and I mean, as we hopefully get a little bit of kind of economic recovery in the UK, I certainly haven't got any plans to expand it further. In terms of the physical side of it, I would love our online orders to continue to grow. They have grown since we started to do that a year ago, but, yeah, a steady growth of those would be great, because we do find that when the day is when the shop's a bit quiet, having some of those to pick upon is like it can be a real godsend. Yeah, but for me, I just want to continue to have quality time with my family and friends and to have a staff team that feel happy and valued, which is really, really important. And we do have a lot of fun.

Charlie: 48:21

We have a lot of laughs and there's been various kind of like formations of the team over the years as people's circumstances have changed. People have come and gone for a whole wide variety of important reasons, like finishing studying or like Cooley moving to a different part of the country she moved down to Devon. So, yeah, just always enjoying it, I think, is the main thing. Every time I spend some time in the shop interacting with customers and with the rest of the team. I'm always reminded by how much I really enjoy what I do, and I always tell customers that I'll say, oh, you know, I get up every day and, okay, I do work hard and I do sometimes put in long days and long weeks and so on, but I still really really enjoy it and really get a real buzz out of it.

Charlie: 49:13

And so that's kind of my main goal really to just carry on enjoying it and hopefully, as a business, will continue to be viable and, in different ways, successful, because you have to rewire your brain and not see it all as sales or success. I think there's many, many ways to measure success and sometimes we don't always do enough of that as small business owners, do we? So, yeah, to just continue, I have written an e-book about starting points for sustainability. I kind of went on a Federation of Small Business Workshop Day where it was about different ways that you can share your knowledge and expertise, and I was like scribbling notes down and then got home and like, yeah, I've created this e-book, so I want to share that at some point in the next few weeks, and it's not a paid for thing, it's a free thing, but I just hope that it'll be a way to kind of continue, like you say, to educate and bring people together in different ways.

Zoe: 50:19

Fabulous In terms of your store, do you think? Do you well, I mean, have you thought about bringing in some of your theater experience into that store to create something that is kind of fun, because I can totally see the two things working together. Well, we have put.

Charlie: 50:40

I mean it's hard for me to describe over audio without anyone actually like, without someone actually experiencing it, but when I tell you that we have put so much thought into the way that people interact with the actual physical space of the shop. So both times I've had some help from a local lady who is an interior designer. Oh, she's just, yeah, when she talks you just listen. She's just so knowledgeable. And so we've kind of joined forces with her and we've both put in the things that we thought the shop needed.

Charlie: 51:18

But, yeah, everything from, like, the flow of the space, the use of the ceiling height in the Stratford shop, the materials that we've used so to make it tactile, make it hard wearing, make it clean. And then, yeah, there are certain points within the shop where you interact with things, like the peanut butter machine being one, for example, where it's a piece of theatre. You know, you put a jar underneath, you press a button, there's nuts in the top, peanut butter comes out and it's just magical. So, yeah, all those different aspects which I'm sure customers never really noticed, but the lighting and, yeah, every shop display you create is a piece of theatre and it's so right, isn't it? So you know, oh, it's wonderful to hear you say that the rainbow with brightly coloured water bottles and, yeah, the various house plants that we have kind of living existence with us, and yeah, so I can totally see why you think that and I completely agree with you Amazing.

Zoe: 52:17

Charlie, where can people find out more about you or indeed come and visit your store?

Charlie: 52:22

So our Lemington shop is located at 41 Russell Street and our Stratford upon Avon shop is 20 B Rother Street, which really handily is directly opposite the American fountain, which is very much an unmarking centre of Stratford upon Avon. You can find us on Instagram and Facebook and now threads at zero store dot UK and as I do feel free to follow us on there and then our website is really easy to remember it's zero store dot co dot UK, and on there you can find all of the lovely products that we start.

Zoe: 52:56

But you can also access the blog, which has a whole host of information on there, so there's recipes as how to guide some interviews suppliers, all sorts, because I was going to ask you where does somebody even start with you know their sustainable journey, but it sounds to me like you've covered that with your resources on your website.

Charlie: 53:17

Yeah, I tried to do that because if people say, oh, you know how do I use this product, it's all well and good me telling them in the shop, but it's a bit of an information overload. So, yeah, we have it on our website and then we do have some QR codes in the shop that people can scan to take them to the guide or we can point them in that direction, and it works really really well then to make those products a bit more accessible. Perfect.

Zoe: 53:39

It's been wonderful to meet somebody so passionate about what they're doing and making such a positive impact in their community.

Charlie: 53:45

Thank you. Thank you so much. Thanks so much for having me on. I've loved it.

Zoe: 53:50

So before I go, here are your takeaways from the interview with Jolly. Number one surround yourself with a great support network. Number two do your planning. Whatever you're starting, factor in all the numbers and how it can fit around your life or your family. Number three don't be afraid to swap regular stability for your dream. You don't have to quit. You might be able to phase out gradually and make it easier to take the leap. Number four do your research Okay your ideal customers. Find out what they really want. Five don't be afraid to approach the bigger businesses and the more experienced people. Shared values and ideas will really give you something to connect over.

Zoe: 54:40

Number six if you have any sort of following, use that platform as a force for good. It's not just about making a quick sale Take with other businesses. It can make financial sense, but it can also offer a better service to your customers. Number eight take the time to do the things you enjoy and rest when you need. Prioritize creativity and your well-being. And number nine there are many ways to measure success, so we need to learn to look beyond the standard financial goals and the other areas of our lives where we can feel successful.

Zoe: 55:26

I hope you loved today's episode and you made you think differently or perhaps nudged you into changing something in your life that's not working for you. I'd love to give you a shout out right here on the podcast too, so let me know what you think, what you'd like to hear more of, or how you've been inspired by what you've heard. Just keep in touch over on Instagram, at mischiefandhide, or sign up to my newsletter at soygreenheartcom. If you're enjoying being part of the mischief movement, please consider telling a friend or leaving me a review wherever you download your episodes, which will seriously help my mission to inspire and empower more people like us to choose mischief over mediocre. Ciao.

Charlie: 56:16

Yeah, I mean, I certainly didn't have the same trajectory through. I said, no, was that you with the microwave? Are you serious? I made you carry it. You can do it. Sorry, that was my husband with the microwave. I'll start my sentence again. Look, do you want to let him finish his cooking?

Zoe: 56:33

Do you want to finish your cooking?

Charlie: 56:39

You haven't eaten all day. I'm staying on tour.